[osis-core] [Fwd: Re: Lockman Bibles for the Sword project]
Troy A. Griffitts
osis-core@bibletechnologieswg.org
Fri, 17 Oct 2003 16:34:20 -0700
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In case it is of interest, or might provide some weight to my hope for
the few additions I've asked to encode their data-- from Pike Lambeth,
VP of Operations, Lockman:
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From: "Pike Lambeth" <pike@lockman.org>
To: "'Troy A. Griffitts'" <scribe@crosswire.org>
Subject: RE: Lockman Bibles for the Sword project
Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 16:22:25 -0700
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Hi Troy,
It is good to hear from you. I was just wondering about the status of your
project.
1. Yes, our translators thought the new paragraph should be at verse 2. I
know there are more situations like this but I do not have a list.
2. I would agree with you. If <q> is used for OT quotes, making an
exceptional use for it complicates possible future processing based on the
<q> and </q> codes. You would then always need to account for the exception
in any coding. Especially since the closing code is the same. The OT city is
not related in any way to OT quotes. (Forgive me if I missed your point on
this one).
3. An algorithm to insert continuing quotes when rendering is more
complicated than one would think. It is one of those algorithms that seems
easy until special cases arise. I would not recommend that as the method of
doing it. One complicated issue is the following: There are only continuing
quotes if the previous punctuation is terminating such as a ".", "?", "!".
To identify this is not as easy as it may seem. There could be any number of
other codes following these terminating punctuation such as <long dash>,
quote, end of verse reference, footnote, and so on. It would be much more
reliable to have them in the data and previously proofread.
I hope my input helps.
I have seen a little on the OSIS specification but have not studied them. I
would love to have a copy of the NASB in this format to see what it is like.
Thanks.
Pike
Pike Lambeth (pike@lockman.org)
Vice President, Operations
The Lockman Foundation
714-879-3055
-----Original Message-----
From: Troy A. Griffitts [mailto:scribe@crosswire.org]
Sent: Tuesday, October 14, 2003 5:23 PM
To: Pike Lambeth
Subject: Re: Lockman Bibles for the Sword project
Pike,
Troy, from CrossWire, here. My apologies for the long delay in getting
to your text. We have just finished a new version of our engine and
client software for most platforms we support that include support for
all the detailed markup data in the NASB that you sent. I've just
started converting your data now and it should be ready as a SWORD
module in a few weeks.
As you might also know, we're involved with the American Bible Society,
Wycliffe, SBL, UBS, IBS, and many others to develop a common XML markup
standard for Bibles:
http://www.bibletechnologies.org
Version 2.0 of the OSIS (Open Scripture Information Standard) spec
should be available any day, and I have been fighting for a few new
mechanism so that I might be able to completely encode your NASB data in
the OSIS specification.
I have a few questions where your comments might help me succeed in
getting these tags added:
1) To quote your data from Matthew 8:34-9:2
{{40:8}}34 And behold<MG2400>, the whole<MG3956> city<MG4172>
came<MG1831> out to meet<MG5222> Jesus<MG2424>; and when they
saw<MG3708> Him, <RA>they implored<MG3870> Him to leave<MG3327> their
region<MG3725>.
CHAPTER 9
<SH>A Paralytic Healed
{{40:9}}1 Getting<MG1684> into a boat<MG4143>, Jesus crossed<MG1276>
over<MG1276> {the sea} and came<MG2064> to <RA>His own<MG2398> city<MG4172>.
<PM>{{40:9}}2 <RA>And they brought<MG4374> to Him a
<RB>paralytic<MG3885> lying<MG906> on a bed<MG2825b>. Seeing<MG3708>
their faith<MG4102>, Jesus<MG2424> said<MG3004> to the
paralytic<MG3885>, <RS>``<RC>Take<MG2293> courage<MG2293>,
<N1>son<MG5043>; <RD>your sins<MG266> are forgiven<MG863>."<RT>
There is a <PM> (paragraph break mark) after verse 1 in chapter 9. I
would guess that this means that your editors disagreed with Jerome and
think the paragraph ending Chapter 8 continues into the first verse of
Chapter 9, which seem to me to be a fine conclusion. Can you confirm
that 9:1 belongs with the paragraph at the end of 8? (or any similar
case where the NASB does not feel that a new paragraph begins at each
chapter mark).
2) OT cites in the NT. Currently, there is no OSIS tag for such an
entity. I feel that a typological distinction is common enough in most
modern translations (you use SMALL CAPS) to warrant a tag for such a
thing. The few OSIS editors that I am arguing with feel that we should
just use <q> (quote) to mark these, and possibly set these off with a
special type, for example <q type="OTCite">stone which the builders
rejected</q>
I personally feel that <q> assigns a misleading literal quote attribute
to the text (which is usually not cited word for word). Do you have any
thoughts regarding the issue?
3) Continuation quotes. This one I'm not sure about. Your data seems
to include continuation quote marks in many places. One osis editor
feels that these should not ever be marked in the data and that an
algorithm should insert them in the correct places when rendering. I
want to faithfully encode your data, without losing anything. Do you
feel that the continuation quote marks could be removed in an encoding
of your data and then faithfully reconstructed with an algorithm?
Thank you for your time on this. I would love to give you back my
conversion script for your data if it would be useful to you. Our
software has started supporting much of the OSIS specification in this
last release, and we are planning to use it as our default encoding for
the foreseeable future.
In His Grace,
-Troy A. Griffitts
Director
CrossWire Bible Society
Pike Lambeth wrote:
> Mr. Hughes,
>
> Thank you for requesting the use of the NASB, Amplified and LBLA Bibles in
> The Sword Project.
>
> I downloaded the software and have been working with it. It seems to be a
> very robust and powerful program.
>
> We will consider the options you've proposed. However, with the holidays
> quickly approaching, I don't think we will be able to make a decision
until
> sometime January.
>
> Two initial questions we have are:
>
> Can you provide an estimate of the percentage each operating system holds
in
> your user base? If possible, please include the BibleTime Unix platform in
> the mix and any others based on The Sword Project you know about.
>
> We have cross-references and translator's notes that are normally in the
> center-column of a center column reference Bible and a NASB database with
> our Strong's type numbering system imbedded which is tied to our
> Hebrew-Aramaic, and Greek dictionaries for the NASB. Is it possible for
> these works to be included in a NASB package for your software?
>
> Thanks,
> Pike
>
> Pike Lambeth (pike@lockman.org)
> Vice President, Operations
> The Lockman Foundation
> 714-879-3055
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