[sword-devel] Question about Strong Markup of Matthew 1:20
Art at arthurbolstad.com
Tue Nov 29 13:04:15 MST 2005
Just a translator's note: "de" in Greek (always the second word in a
sentance) is a paragraph marker. As such it is really shown in English
by the indentation. But it "feels" funny if a Greek word is not shown
with an English word.
Greg Hellings wrote:
> I believe your problem can be resolved with a little expounding of
> Greek grammar. Both of the depictions are actually correct. I would
> tend to lean towards the markup you have from Sword as being "more"
> correct, but allow me to explain it with the following:
> The Greek, with the direct "interlinear" style translation under it reads:
> tauta de autou enthumethentos
> these things but he while thought
> I don't usually work with Strongs, but if I can guess what Strongs is
> doing here it comes down to this:
> Word 1161 is the particle "de" which is loosely translated as "but"
> although it simply means a continuation of the story, action or
> thought and is equally well translated "and, so" etc.
> Word 846 is probably actually "autou" - which in this case is the
> genitive form of the pronoun "he."
> Word 1760 is the genitive "enthumethentos" - the genitive participle
> of "thought on."
> Word 5023 is clearly the plural verb "tauta" which means "these" or
> "these things."
> When the genitive pronoun is combined with the genitive participle
> (the words "autou enthumethentos") the result is what is called, in
> Greek, the "genitive absolute." Normally when a noun appears in the
> genitive it indicates possession of something, but when it is combined
> with a participle, the result could mean almost anything. Most
> translators would understand the phrase to mean "while he was
> thinking" but genitive absolutes have to be translated a bunch of
> different ways, all depending on the context. Sometimes it could
> equally well be "because" or "after" or "before" or any other number
> of meanings. The translator has to figure it out from the context.
> So, essentially, the word "while" does not, strictly speaking, appear
> in this passage. However, most of the time in your Bible that you see
> the word "while" and sometimes even the word "because" and so on, the
> Greek actually has this same exact construct. So the word "while"
> could be thought of as either part of the noun (word 846) or as part
> of the verb (word 1760). So both versions of the Strong's markup are
> technically valid, but the one you get from Sword is more accurate.
> Ideally, the word "while" would somehow be indicated as a supplied
> word in the English translation, if the reader is supposed to be
> working from the Greek. Many older KJV bibles had this feature by
> means of italicizing words. However, for everyday readers, this
> results in less clarity because they think that the italicized word
> has greater importance, whereas the italics usually mean that the use
> of this word was *more* of an interpretive decision than the words
> around it. So you might say that the following is a better parsing of
> the text:
> 1161 -> But, and, so
> while -> understood from context, also valid as "because" or other
> possible meanings
> 846 -> he
> 1760 -> thought on
> 5023 -> these things
> Hope that helps more than it confuses. If you really want to learn
> more, get a good Greek grammar that will teach you something about the
> genitive absolute construct. Or, better yet, do that anyway and learn
> some Greek so you can read the Bible in Greek... actually, I wouldn't
> recommend that course of action; it takes too long and is usually too
> time consuming even when have have learned Greek :).
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